No corpse

havingbeen · Post by **havingbeen** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:35 am

James Mitchell got married in 1848 and appears in the 1851 census.

In 1866 his widow remarries.

I cant find a death cert.

The family has a story which says he disappeared with a sum of money at a hiring fair. Was he murdered for the money? Did he make off with the cash? No body was ever found. The yarn continues that seven years after the event he was declared legally dead.

I cant find anything in the Records. Am I looking in the wrong place??

Help solve a family mystery

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:59 am

Hi havingbeen

And welcome to Talking Scot [talkingscot]

A couple of questions to help us to help you:
Where was your James Mitchell in the 1851 census?
Where did he marry? Wife's name?
And what was his occupation in 1851?

Could he possibly have died between 1851-55? In which case there would be no death cert. for him at that time (Statutory Registration having begun in 1855) Have you checked the OPR deaths for the area (on Scotlands People), if there are any? Or Monumental Inscriptions for the area?

I'm guessing there is no sign of him in the 1861 census? Have you found his wife in the 1861 census? Is she stated as a widow at that time? That would narrow down the date of his death/disappearance to a ten year period. Did James and his wife have any children? Again, the dates of births of children may help to further narrow down the time period.

You may have tried this route too, but might there be anything in local newspapers of the time?

Lots of questions....

Best wishes
Lesley

havingbeen · Post by **havingbeen** » Fri May 01, 2009 9:42 pm

Lesley thanks for your response.

To put more flesh on the bones.

James Mitchell married Mary Holm in the Kilmalcolm OPR 09/02/1849 and in the Erskine OPR 23/02/1849

James Mitchell employed as a farm labourer with wife Mary and son James are in the Houston and Killellan 1851 census returns This is the last trace of James Mitchell.

Mary Mitchell appears as a widow in the 1861 Paisley census with two sons one aged 10 the other 5. Their names appear to be reversed against ages and place of birth. I have record of the 10 year old birth but nothing for the 5 year old so James Mitchell may or may not be his father.

She remarries in 1866 in Paisley.

I haven't tried monumental inscriptions because the story is of no body.

How or where would a legal decision of death after seven years absence be recorded. Any legal eagles with an answer? I don't know if a normal death certificate would be issued or some other legal document. Is that why I can't find evidence of the death in Statutory Records.

Any help appreciated.

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:13 pm

Hi havingbeen

Any legal case, if indeed there was one, and if it has survived, would, I think, be likely to be at NAS. You could try a search of the online catalogue here http://www.nas.gov.uk/onlineCatalogue/ to see if anything turns up, but not everything that is held there is listed in the online catalogue...

I haven't tried monumental inscriptions because the story is of no body.

I'd also be wary of taking family stories at face value. They can be a little like a game we used to play as children called "chinese whipers"; the story may change quite dramatically over the retelling and the years and and does not always reflect what actually happened. If it were me, I'd be checking all avenues so that I did not miss anything. Otherwise it is possible you might spend a lot of time, energy & money chasing a story for which there may be no evidence. Better to explore all the contemporary evidence which does exist, such as the OPRs and MIs to check out any likely candidates which you may find.

James is one you have named, but what is the name of the other son you know of? IGI has these two, both extracts:

JOHN MITCHELL
Birth: 10 JUN 1849 Abbey (Paisley), Renfrew, Scotland
Parents:
Father: JAMES MITCHELL
Mother: MARY HOLMS

JAMES MITCHELL
Birth: 09 FEB 1851
Christening: 03 MAR 1851 Houston And Killellan, Renfrew, Scotland
Parents:
Father: JAMES MITCHELL
Mother: MARY HOLM

Best wishes
Lesley

nelmit · Post by **nelmit** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:36 pm

I'm finding it difficult to find James snr and Mary with wee James in 1851 although I can find John living with his grandparents.

Are you 100% sure you have the correct Mary in 1861 as according to Ancestry she was born at Ayrshire?...........but then again it is Ancestry.

Regards,
Annette

nelmit · Post by **nelmit** » Sat May 02, 2009 12:28 am

I wonder if I'm on the right track?

Does Mary marry John Crawford in 1866 at Paisley?

In 1881 this Mary Crawford born Kilbarchan has a grand-daughter Mary Mitchell living with her.

Wee Mary's parents appear to be James Mitchell and Margaret Manwell who married in 1871. Margaret dies in 1874.

Is this the family you are researching?

Regards,
Annette

Currie · Post by **Currie** » Sat May 02, 2009 10:56 am

Hello Havingbeen,

I’m not even a Legal Sparrow unfortunately.

The Presumption of Life Limitation (Scotland) Act, 1881, and the Presumption of Life Limitation (Scotland) Act, 1891, made provision for the presumption of death after seven years etc. What was the situation in Scotland prior to 1881? In Hugh Barclay’s A Digest of the Law of Scotland: 1855, “Life” is defined on page 579. No mention of a seven year period. Perhaps it was up to the Court to weigh the evidence and make a decision based on that, with perhaps a provision covering any possible return from the grave. See also “Death” on page 259 and “Bigamy” on page 68.
http://books.google.com.au/books?id=p4A ... J&pg=PA579

Page 579
LIFE. The presumption of life extends to 100 years; but this presumption must yield to proof of death, or facts and circumstances affording sufficient legal presumption thereof; Ersk. B. 4, T. 2, S. 36. See 7th Feb. 1811, Lord Ashburton; 19th Nov. 1845, Lapsley (affirmed.) Caution is generally exacted to repay in case of the party not being dead; 1628, Ruthven, Mor. 8048; 15th July 1852, Craven.

I had a good search of the Glasgow Herald in 1851-61 but didn’t find anything helpful. There are very many James Mitchell’s in the newspapers unfortunately.

If there was no property involved to complicate things maybe the Courts didn’t get involved at all. Is there any sign of a Will on SP? I assume that for her to initialize court action to have him declared dead only so that she could remarry would involve some considerable expense, especially if she had to provide ” proof of death, or facts and circumstances”.

Hope that’s useful,
Alan

havingbeen · Post by **havingbeen** » Sat May 02, 2009 11:18 am

Alan thank you for your efforts in the Glasgow Herald and your information regarding the law. Unfortunately there is no will in SP. I'm returning to Paisley soon and will trawl the local papers in the library there.

havingbeen · Post by **havingbeen** » Sat May 02, 2009 11:41 am

Nelmit
You have the right family. The 1851 census I have is
565/00 001/00 012 with James, Mary and 10month James.

Having looked at the 1861 image it does indeed appear that the bithplace of Mary is Ayr the district however is a bit indistinct and I took it in haste as Kilmacolm. That puts the second son John as doubtful as that census was the only trace I had for him.

Lesley
The second son was indeed John however as you can see from the above I now have doubts about the 1861 census from where I got the name. The record you have for John makes him older tham James yet he is not mentioned with his parents in 1851. Could there be two sets of parents James Mitchell and Mary (Holms) Holm?
I agree with you about family tales buckets rather than pinches of salt should be taken. I mentioned it because as yet I can find no trace of James Mitchells death and it opened up a possible path of enquiry.

Thanks again for your time and advice

John

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Sat May 02, 2009 12:18 pm

Hi John

You have the right family. The 1851 census I have is
565/00 001/00 012 with James, Mary and 10month James.

So, if the James on IGI, born on 9th February 1851 is the correct child to the correct couple, then he should only have been stated as 2months old at the very most when the census was taken at midnight on the night of 30th-31st March 1851. Does the birthplace of the James in the 1851 census tally with the one on IGI?

It is always possible that the earlier son John died and a later John was born to the couple.

Best wishes
Lesley